Look, the front office was almost forced to bring back the same unit as last year - what are you going to do, rebuild a 101-win team - in New York, no less?! So, they went all-in again and it failed this time around for multiple reasons in a meltdown that began last September in Atlanta and continues unabated. It happens, but IMHO the FO response has been spot-on in refusing to mortgage the future for a long shot like the Phillies last year. A smart organization knows when to cut its losses, reduce its payroll by tens of millions (including tax) by unloading a grossly overpaid fading ace who failed twice when it really counted in exchange for an exciting ATHLETIC top prospect controllable for six years, and acquires two more athletic, high-ceiling infielders for a closer they no longer need. And it sends a message to the shell-shocked players that, because of their epic failure, no one deserves to be safe - a shot across the bow for a team is not just the oldest in MLB, but slow at a time when speed has become a premium, and worst of all, boring. Good on the FO for recognizing this group is simply unsuited for the game as played today.
Nope. He’s looked pretty awesome under my watchful eye this week. He’s the current superstar potential all timer on this squad. Let it ride. Nothing to lose.
Mets can’t always dip into free agency and pay players nine figure contracts to contend all smart franchises trade veterans when they aren’t contending to replenish farm system which are assets. I am sorry if nimmo scherez Lindor and others are worried about direction of team then they should have produced this team was a flop. Nimmo mostly produced but McNeil Alonso Lindor all struggled buck made bad moves eppler didn’t restock middle bullpen. I don’t like Eppler but what else did you want them to do bring the band back together. Smart baseball teams win by having young players contribute in their arbitration years. Mets were an old team and folks look at the Braves that’s how you win and compete every season. That’s just my two cents.
Projections are just that. You don't know what Acuña will turn out to be, but you do know Max had become a distraction. Mets are using financial advantage to buy a potential "growth stock" and rid themselves of a pain in the ass who can no longer go three times through an opposing lineup. As for the logjam, who knows? Maybe Acuña or Mauricio or, most likely, McNeil gets shipped out before August 1 or during the off-season.
For those of you who think the Scherzer deal was a great thing consider that the Mets will now need to replace him with someone as yet unknown next year. They only got the one prospect back from Texas and while Acuna is a top prospect where does he fit in with current Mets plans? Then there is the very obvious effect on the clubhouse with even Nimmo echoing the Scherzer line of having the need to have a conversation with the brass about the direction of the team. It appears as if the Mets are now ready to trade Verlander. If they do then yet another pitcher to replace next year. That's 2 starting pitchers and still no improvement in that weakest part of the Mets roster which is middle relief bridging to (for now) Railly and Otiveno. There is no guarantee that Diaz will come back to his dominate self next year either. So, while the Mets have improved their farm system their major league roster has taken a hit and there are no doubts more hits to that roster are coming. Think the Mets will retain Alonso after these trades? Well, just consider his comments post Scherzer trade. I've been saying for quite awhile that a total rebuild is coming and I see nothing in the trades that were made and those that are coming to convince me otherwise. If you are 100% happy with both the Robertson and Scherzer trades then I'm guessing you are going to be 100% happy with the rebuild that is coming and having Eppler leading that rebuild far into the future. Me? Not happy at all and my opinion of Cohen has changed drastically. I see him as no better than the Wilpons and I see the effects of allowing Eppler to engineer these trades as having negative effects far into the future. Don't expect to see a winning Mets team for at least the next 4-5 years. Sad, but very true.
I hear you, Kevan. I think the jury is out. Everyone getting so upset in the clubhouse happens so quickly, and it can turn into happy and hopeful just as fast.
I don’t think it matters that much who the prospects are. The issue with prospects is developing them. Not collecting more and more. I don’t see how adding the five we’ve added through trade of veterans this season makes that much difference compared with the 40 we added through draft and international signing. That the Mets are trying to buy their way to “better” prospect return in trades is foolhardy. In Billy Inneptler’s words, that prospect A, who you bought by paying $30M of the tradee’s salary, gives you a “1, 1and a half” incremental improvement amortized over 4-5 years compared with prospect B who you could have without having to include cash.
Who says? Some momo-headed prospect writer who made up an algorithm a few years ago? But the launch angle. And the twitch speed. Ooh! Give me a break.
Bad trade. Left holding the bag for all that salary in 2024. I’m all in on paying all the 2023 salary. But being what, $25M in the hole heading in to the off season and needing to fill out a rotation and bullpen? Dumb ass.
Trade Verlander for a 30 year old career minor leaguer if the Dodgers take the entire 2024 and potential 2025 liability off our books. He’s an average starter who can be replaced by investing $30M in 4 strong relief pitchers and putting Lucchessi out there to throw the first 3-4 innings every 5th day.
Gotta love lineup today Vogelbach in today after Vientos hit a HR. I get el troll needs a day off but this team is confusing. They trading for prospects but not giving them chances to succeed in big show.
"There just isn’t enough room for Lindor, Nimmo, Acuña, Mauricio AND McNeil past 2024"
SS/CF/2B/LF/RF? Jeff isn't a RFer and I prefer him at 2B but unless you're going to move Nimmo to a corner then where else (other than DH)? They crapped around w/Mauricio for too long (SS/3B/2B and now LF) and it has to have hurt his growth so leave him at LF. Regardless, makes these decisions and stick with them.
The numbers I see in the ZIPS projection JB posted don’t look so strong to me. This Acuna fellow is gonna hit 240? In his worst year (this one), McNeil beats that by a whole lot. It looks like we traded for the next Jonathan Villar. Woo hoo!
If there is one player who we absolutely can not count on next year, it’s Marte. We are stuck paying him $40M over the next two years, where he would get maybe a $6M one year see what he can do offer on the open market if he were a free agent. That’s a $14M hole in the 2024 budget. We now have added a $25 M hole from the Scherzer deal. We need a starting pitcher and we need a right fielder. We also over pay Lindor each year by about $10M compared to what he’d get if he were free right now.
Not to mention rebuilding the middle relief corps. Too many holes to fill for 2024 to be a competitive one. Apparently Eppler is Cohen's golden boy who can do no wrong-I mean right
How's that vacation going?
Haha swimmingly!
Look, the front office was almost forced to bring back the same unit as last year - what are you going to do, rebuild a 101-win team - in New York, no less?! So, they went all-in again and it failed this time around for multiple reasons in a meltdown that began last September in Atlanta and continues unabated. It happens, but IMHO the FO response has been spot-on in refusing to mortgage the future for a long shot like the Phillies last year. A smart organization knows when to cut its losses, reduce its payroll by tens of millions (including tax) by unloading a grossly overpaid fading ace who failed twice when it really counted in exchange for an exciting ATHLETIC top prospect controllable for six years, and acquires two more athletic, high-ceiling infielders for a closer they no longer need. And it sends a message to the shell-shocked players that, because of their epic failure, no one deserves to be safe - a shot across the bow for a team is not just the oldest in MLB, but slow at a time when speed has become a premium, and worst of all, boring. Good on the FO for recognizing this group is simply unsuited for the game as played today.
Interesting tidbit: Max will be reunited with his former pitching coach from the Nats, Mike Maddux, who is now Texas’s pitching coach.
Pete needs to talk as well? He’s not a bright guy, is he?
The Pete line was just dumb. He’s that surprised? Really?
Hey, maybe unload Palooka Pete before his inevitable decline.
Pete is coming across very arrogant and self absorbed this season. He needs to get over himself.
Nope. He’s looked pretty awesome under my watchful eye this week. He’s the current superstar potential all timer on this squad. Let it ride. Nothing to lose.
Pete is not a bright guy at all.
DFA Vogelbach right now. It must stop.
We talked to a bunch of fans last and everyone feels the same way. No emotion, just factual. It must end.
Surprised by the deal. I like it. We got $22 million and Acuna back for Max. Seems like a good deal for both teams.
I move Acuna to CF immediately. That's where he can help us. Hopefully he works out.
Mets can’t always dip into free agency and pay players nine figure contracts to contend all smart franchises trade veterans when they aren’t contending to replenish farm system which are assets. I am sorry if nimmo scherez Lindor and others are worried about direction of team then they should have produced this team was a flop. Nimmo mostly produced but McNeil Alonso Lindor all struggled buck made bad moves eppler didn’t restock middle bullpen. I don’t like Eppler but what else did you want them to do bring the band back together. Smart baseball teams win by having young players contribute in their arbitration years. Mets were an old team and folks look at the Braves that’s how you win and compete every season. That’s just my two cents.
Then I guess you're okay with them trading Nimmo & Co. That's the logic isn't it?
No one said to trade players signed long term contracts. It’s about trading players who are in last year deal and they aren’t contending anyways.
Projections are just that. You don't know what Acuña will turn out to be, but you do know Max had become a distraction. Mets are using financial advantage to buy a potential "growth stock" and rid themselves of a pain in the ass who can no longer go three times through an opposing lineup. As for the logjam, who knows? Maybe Acuña or Mauricio or, most likely, McNeil gets shipped out before August 1 or during the off-season.
Not everyone needs to be a starter forever. McNeil might be a very nice utility guy by 2025.
For those of you who think the Scherzer deal was a great thing consider that the Mets will now need to replace him with someone as yet unknown next year. They only got the one prospect back from Texas and while Acuna is a top prospect where does he fit in with current Mets plans? Then there is the very obvious effect on the clubhouse with even Nimmo echoing the Scherzer line of having the need to have a conversation with the brass about the direction of the team. It appears as if the Mets are now ready to trade Verlander. If they do then yet another pitcher to replace next year. That's 2 starting pitchers and still no improvement in that weakest part of the Mets roster which is middle relief bridging to (for now) Railly and Otiveno. There is no guarantee that Diaz will come back to his dominate self next year either. So, while the Mets have improved their farm system their major league roster has taken a hit and there are no doubts more hits to that roster are coming. Think the Mets will retain Alonso after these trades? Well, just consider his comments post Scherzer trade. I've been saying for quite awhile that a total rebuild is coming and I see nothing in the trades that were made and those that are coming to convince me otherwise. If you are 100% happy with both the Robertson and Scherzer trades then I'm guessing you are going to be 100% happy with the rebuild that is coming and having Eppler leading that rebuild far into the future. Me? Not happy at all and my opinion of Cohen has changed drastically. I see him as no better than the Wilpons and I see the effects of allowing Eppler to engineer these trades as having negative effects far into the future. Don't expect to see a winning Mets team for at least the next 4-5 years. Sad, but very true.
I hear you, Kevan. I think the jury is out. Everyone getting so upset in the clubhouse happens so quickly, and it can turn into happy and hopeful just as fast.
I don’t think it matters that much who the prospects are. The issue with prospects is developing them. Not collecting more and more. I don’t see how adding the five we’ve added through trade of veterans this season makes that much difference compared with the 40 we added through draft and international signing. That the Mets are trying to buy their way to “better” prospect return in trades is foolhardy. In Billy Inneptler’s words, that prospect A, who you bought by paying $30M of the tradee’s salary, gives you a “1, 1and a half” incremental improvement amortized over 4-5 years compared with prospect B who you could have without having to include cash.
Who says? Some momo-headed prospect writer who made up an algorithm a few years ago? But the launch angle. And the twitch speed. Ooh! Give me a break.
Bad trade. Left holding the bag for all that salary in 2024. I’m all in on paying all the 2023 salary. But being what, $25M in the hole heading in to the off season and needing to fill out a rotation and bullpen? Dumb ass.
Trade Verlander for a 30 year old career minor leaguer if the Dodgers take the entire 2024 and potential 2025 liability off our books. He’s an average starter who can be replaced by investing $30M in 4 strong relief pitchers and putting Lucchessi out there to throw the first 3-4 innings every 5th day.
Gotta love lineup today Vogelbach in today after Vientos hit a HR. I get el troll needs a day off but this team is confusing. They trading for prospects but not giving them chances to succeed in big show.
"There just isn’t enough room for Lindor, Nimmo, Acuña, Mauricio AND McNeil past 2024"
SS/CF/2B/LF/RF? Jeff isn't a RFer and I prefer him at 2B but unless you're going to move Nimmo to a corner then where else (other than DH)? They crapped around w/Mauricio for too long (SS/3B/2B and now LF) and it has to have hurt his growth so leave him at LF. Regardless, makes these decisions and stick with them.
The numbers I see in the ZIPS projection JB posted don’t look so strong to me. This Acuna fellow is gonna hit 240? In his worst year (this one), McNeil beats that by a whole lot. It looks like we traded for the next Jonathan Villar. Woo hoo!
This ignores Marte who is under contract through 2025 so yeah, a lot of pieces. Maybe Jeff becomes the full-time DH.
If there is one player who we absolutely can not count on next year, it’s Marte. We are stuck paying him $40M over the next two years, where he would get maybe a $6M one year see what he can do offer on the open market if he were a free agent. That’s a $14M hole in the 2024 budget. We now have added a $25 M hole from the Scherzer deal. We need a starting pitcher and we need a right fielder. We also over pay Lindor each year by about $10M compared to what he’d get if he were free right now.
Billy Inneptler. How does he still have a job?
Not to mention rebuilding the middle relief corps. Too many holes to fill for 2024 to be a competitive one. Apparently Eppler is Cohen's golden boy who can do no wrong-I mean right