Last night was delightful on every level. Ticked off every box. That was baseball how it oughtta be. I love getaway day games and am looking forward to watching the Mets face their third southpaw in a row. Obviously, Kershaw is no ordinary lefty but the Dodgers sure are giving the Mets a lot of practice in this area. Thank you, Dodgers. It's September 1st, Mets fans, and they are in the stretch run. The Mets may not look as pretty as the Dodgers but we have our own brand of resilience and determination that rivals any team in baseball. #LFGM
As a long time fan - last night game was a real treat ! Us Mets fans deserve it. The crowd, The Trumpet, The Catch, Jake it doesnt get any better. If anyone talks to Buck please convey this answer to "What would you do with Ruff" " Duh Buck "you bench him all the way to the club house and call up Vientos"
Calling up Vientos seems to be the popular decision among the fans. Maybe the Mets know something that the rest of us do not? It's quite possible his defense is not up to major league standards. Maybe he lacks the mental toughness needed to make the jump. I'm inclined to trust the Mets on this one.
I think it's a dumb idea and a massive failure on the part of some fans.
Look at these Mets. Look at Buck. He's the first manager to come along who values defense. Who recognized and valued Guillorme. Who said no to JD Davis at 3B and Dom Smith in LF -- because defense, and quality team play, matter.
Look at that game last night. Great pitching and strong defense. That's the Mets in 2022, playing baseball the right way. Crisp, clean, well-played games.
Now the fans are screaming for a guy who can't field at all?
As for Ruf, he's a great hitter against LHP, career .911 OPS. He's taken good ABs in a very difficult role. We traded 4 guys for him. Deal with it and don't be so eager for the shiny, new thing.
If there's fault here, it's in our minor league system that has been unable to turn Vientos into an adequate defender. Maybe it was an impossible task. Oh well. Maybe he can take the role in 2023. I believe in his bat -- but this is not the year.
A bit harsh Jimmy. No one is screaming. No one is saying start him at third. We’re saying it would be interesting to see how he does as a RH DH. We’re saying so far we haven’t gotten anything from Ruf, and the Giants didn’t his year either. But Vientos’ numbers against lefties at AA and AAA are eye-popping at age 21-22, and in our decades watching this game usually numbers like that earn at least an audition from one of the top prospects in the system. Especially when the 36 year old part time DH we brought in earlier in the year hasn’t performed well.
But no doubt the fact that he isn’t up is an indictment of the player development system. Something appears to be wrong with him, and they’ve been touting him for 5 years now, and there doesn’t appear to be a solution.
In a seven game series against the Dodgers this season the Mets are 3-3 with 2 wins in Chavez Ravine. Good playoff practice. Except for Pete's penchant for chasing fastballs, last night was great. The little trumpets were a little too much for my cynicism, but the overall effect works. If someone was at the game, do those actually work? It would be really funny if the whole stadium started to vuvuzala (however those SA World Cup things are spelled) the opposing batters going to the plate.
As for Baty, that is a bummer. Vientos is only coming up if they move Baty to the 60-day and someone else gets DFA'd or put on IL. To be honest I'd like to see Lucchesi added to the bullpen but to do so with Smith and Megill coming back would make Vientos an odd man out to stay at 14 pitchers....I think? Someone please check my math/logic w/ current rosters on the website
but Lucchesi technically doesn't count against it when on 60-day. Once he comes off and MeGill 2 people gotta go, right? Isn't that part of the wilpon/sandy logic of floating injured players all those years so they can manipulate optionable players?
Correct re: needing to remove 2 players once those guys are ready to go. I was just indicating that Vientos doesn't need to be added. He also won't be one of those cut if/when they bring back Megill or Lucchesi.
I hope they don't. He was added once he started to get good along with Alvarez to prevent rule 5 draft eligibility. The way this year is trending - and they continue to hold onto Mauricio - if he doesn't come up in September does this baseball ops group feel it's worth the risk to leave him open to that? This FO has high standards on defense and K rates. Keeping Mazeika and the FA/waiver wire says the Mets don't have faith in Alvarez' defense or pitch calling in spite of the bat and power, and he hasn't hit in AAA to boot. For Vientos, while he's having a better statistical full season at AAA has basically been told 'he's not good enough defensively or with splits to earn a call up, directly or indirectly, almost monthly. The only players Sandy said were 'untouchable' pre deadline were Baty and Alvarez. Where's the faith in the player? Seems like they are waiting on a trade opportunity for him.
It’s just weird organizational ambivalence with Vientos, isn’t it? They put him on the 40, he progresses up the minor league ladder with demonstrated tangible evidence of blossoming into a legit slugger in his AA and AAA years, and he’s only 22. They don’t trade him with obvious needs at the deadline, and they don’t promote him, again with obvious needs from the right side DH position, even with the expanded rosters, and even with his also providing some depth at positions where we are thin (ok he’s “no good”, but in an emergency, whatever) and even with his having cut down on his K rate over the past month and a half or so, and even with his improving performance against right handers.
The Athletic's Mets Beat reporter Tim Britton dropped an article with the title 'The Mets could use a bat. Why isn't prospect Mark Vientos the answer?" earlier this morning. Sorry if not a subscriber, there's a pay wall.
Ruf is a dog. Maybe I’m too hasty based on small sample size, but he’s failed repeatedly and isn’t providing any protection for Alonso. So why not give Vientos a shot at DH? We haven’t hit lefties all year, and haven’t been hitting against anybody in the past 2 weeks. So the plan is to bring up two guys that can’t even hit in AAA?
I like Ruf, he's a tremendous hitter vs. LHP and it's an extremely tough role. Small sample size? He's an 8-year veteran w/ a career slash against LHP of .276/.373/.537 for an OPS of .911.
Bob, no, not right. You are grasping at straws. He's never been a starting player, usually around 250-300 PA a season. In 2022, forced into more ABs with Giants due to injury. But you are correct that it is extremely difficult to produce in his specific role. It was hard on JD, too. Why do you assume that Vientos, at 22, is going to do better? Give him some time and let it play out. The Vientos thing is a fantasy dreamed up by fans who don't seem to comprehend what Buck Showalter, Billy Eppler, or the 2022 NY Mets are all about. In addition, the Mets are looking to enrich and support the roster, not duplicate (already limited) roles. Add a glove, add some speed, an arm.
But this season he’s not close to that. And he’s had plenty of playing time this season, so it’s not a small sample. Maybe at 36 years old he’s not the hitter he was. It wouldn’t be unusual. (That doesn’t make him “a dog” 😉)
I think we’re just asking for a look. At this point it seems worth it. Ruf has a higher floor for the reasons you’ve said, but Vientos has a higher ceiling. What’s the harm in bringing him up for a few games and seeing if there’s some magic?
Because you are building a team, a roster. The Mets have one 3B glove right now, Escobar's. That's it. They lack speed and have two slow guys at DH. They surely could use another arm. Why duplicate the extremely limited role of DH against LHP and ignore other more pressing needs? Because you are hoping for magic? That's the plan? Again, you have to ignore just about everything about the 2022 NY Mets in order to think that bringing up Vientos at this point is the right move.
I am seeing a player with strong ABs -- I've liked what I've seen -- and an .800+ OPS this very year w/ serious pop.
He's the guy they traded for. He's the guy. You don't get anywhere in baseball by casting aside perfectly good players because of a brief dry spell. We had someone here screaming to DFA Escobar. Where would we be right now without him? Who would play 3B?
Ruf is our guy and he is far more proven -- and likely fits in the clubhouse better -- than 22-year-old Vientos who we'd be asking to adapt to an extremely difficult role.
Last night was delightful on every level. Ticked off every box. That was baseball how it oughtta be. I love getaway day games and am looking forward to watching the Mets face their third southpaw in a row. Obviously, Kershaw is no ordinary lefty but the Dodgers sure are giving the Mets a lot of practice in this area. Thank you, Dodgers. It's September 1st, Mets fans, and they are in the stretch run. The Mets may not look as pretty as the Dodgers but we have our own brand of resilience and determination that rivals any team in baseball. #LFGM
Enjoyed this newsletter a lot. One of your best. LGM.
Thank you!!!
Agree. And another great subject title!
As a long time fan - last night game was a real treat ! Us Mets fans deserve it. The crowd, The Trumpet, The Catch, Jake it doesnt get any better. If anyone talks to Buck please convey this answer to "What would you do with Ruff" " Duh Buck "you bench him all the way to the club house and call up Vientos"
Calling up Vientos seems to be the popular decision among the fans. Maybe the Mets know something that the rest of us do not? It's quite possible his defense is not up to major league standards. Maybe he lacks the mental toughness needed to make the jump. I'm inclined to trust the Mets on this one.
I think it's a dumb idea and a massive failure on the part of some fans.
Look at these Mets. Look at Buck. He's the first manager to come along who values defense. Who recognized and valued Guillorme. Who said no to JD Davis at 3B and Dom Smith in LF -- because defense, and quality team play, matter.
Look at that game last night. Great pitching and strong defense. That's the Mets in 2022, playing baseball the right way. Crisp, clean, well-played games.
Now the fans are screaming for a guy who can't field at all?
As for Ruf, he's a great hitter against LHP, career .911 OPS. He's taken good ABs in a very difficult role. We traded 4 guys for him. Deal with it and don't be so eager for the shiny, new thing.
If there's fault here, it's in our minor league system that has been unable to turn Vientos into an adequate defender. Maybe it was an impossible task. Oh well. Maybe he can take the role in 2023. I believe in his bat -- but this is not the year.
A bit harsh Jimmy. No one is screaming. No one is saying start him at third. We’re saying it would be interesting to see how he does as a RH DH. We’re saying so far we haven’t gotten anything from Ruf, and the Giants didn’t his year either. But Vientos’ numbers against lefties at AA and AAA are eye-popping at age 21-22, and in our decades watching this game usually numbers like that earn at least an audition from one of the top prospects in the system. Especially when the 36 year old part time DH we brought in earlier in the year hasn’t performed well.
But no doubt the fact that he isn’t up is an indictment of the player development system. Something appears to be wrong with him, and they’ve been touting him for 5 years now, and there doesn’t appear to be a solution.
When they started handing out those tiny trumpets in the 7th inning, I was like, "TOO SOON!"
At least wait until we get through Ottavino (who was excellent).
But everything worked out just swell.
In a seven game series against the Dodgers this season the Mets are 3-3 with 2 wins in Chavez Ravine. Good playoff practice. Except for Pete's penchant for chasing fastballs, last night was great. The little trumpets were a little too much for my cynicism, but the overall effect works. If someone was at the game, do those actually work? It would be really funny if the whole stadium started to vuvuzala (however those SA World Cup things are spelled) the opposing batters going to the plate.
As for Baty, that is a bummer. Vientos is only coming up if they move Baty to the 60-day and someone else gets DFA'd or put on IL. To be honest I'd like to see Lucchesi added to the bullpen but to do so with Smith and Megill coming back would make Vientos an odd man out to stay at 14 pitchers....I think? Someone please check my math/logic w/ current rosters on the website
Vientos is already on the 40-man, so they wouldn't need to worry about that part of the equation.
but Lucchesi technically doesn't count against it when on 60-day. Once he comes off and MeGill 2 people gotta go, right? Isn't that part of the wilpon/sandy logic of floating injured players all those years so they can manipulate optionable players?
Correct re: needing to remove 2 players once those guys are ready to go. I was just indicating that Vientos doesn't need to be added. He also won't be one of those cut if/when they bring back Megill or Lucchesi.
I hope they don't. He was added once he started to get good along with Alvarez to prevent rule 5 draft eligibility. The way this year is trending - and they continue to hold onto Mauricio - if he doesn't come up in September does this baseball ops group feel it's worth the risk to leave him open to that? This FO has high standards on defense and K rates. Keeping Mazeika and the FA/waiver wire says the Mets don't have faith in Alvarez' defense or pitch calling in spite of the bat and power, and he hasn't hit in AAA to boot. For Vientos, while he's having a better statistical full season at AAA has basically been told 'he's not good enough defensively or with splits to earn a call up, directly or indirectly, almost monthly. The only players Sandy said were 'untouchable' pre deadline were Baty and Alvarez. Where's the faith in the player? Seems like they are waiting on a trade opportunity for him.
It’s just weird organizational ambivalence with Vientos, isn’t it? They put him on the 40, he progresses up the minor league ladder with demonstrated tangible evidence of blossoming into a legit slugger in his AA and AAA years, and he’s only 22. They don’t trade him with obvious needs at the deadline, and they don’t promote him, again with obvious needs from the right side DH position, even with the expanded rosters, and even with his also providing some depth at positions where we are thin (ok he’s “no good”, but in an emergency, whatever) and even with his having cut down on his K rate over the past month and a half or so, and even with his improving performance against right handers.
They might trade him this offseason, but there is a 0% chance they DFA/waive him.
The Athletic's Mets Beat reporter Tim Britton dropped an article with the title 'The Mets could use a bat. Why isn't prospect Mark Vientos the answer?" earlier this morning. Sorry if not a subscriber, there's a pay wall.
Vientos could be a piece in the Ohtani trade.
I really think needs a day off. A reset.
Ruf is a dog. Maybe I’m too hasty based on small sample size, but he’s failed repeatedly and isn’t providing any protection for Alonso. So why not give Vientos a shot at DH? We haven’t hit lefties all year, and haven’t been hitting against anybody in the past 2 weeks. So the plan is to bring up two guys that can’t even hit in AAA?
I like Ruf, he's a tremendous hitter vs. LHP and it's an extremely tough role. Small sample size? He's an 8-year veteran w/ a career slash against LHP of .276/.373/.537 for an OPS of .911.
Ruf put up those lefty splits while playing every day, right? Some players don’t produce when they play only once or twice a week.
Bob, no, not right. You are grasping at straws. He's never been a starting player, usually around 250-300 PA a season. In 2022, forced into more ABs with Giants due to injury. But you are correct that it is extremely difficult to produce in his specific role. It was hard on JD, too. Why do you assume that Vientos, at 22, is going to do better? Give him some time and let it play out. The Vientos thing is a fantasy dreamed up by fans who don't seem to comprehend what Buck Showalter, Billy Eppler, or the 2022 NY Mets are all about. In addition, the Mets are looking to enrich and support the roster, not duplicate (already limited) roles. Add a glove, add some speed, an arm.
Ruf is in the lineup today for the third straight game. Let’s hope he gets untracked.
The small sample size refers to his tenure so far with the Mets. He’s been doing a McCann impersonation. Yes, I’m impatient.
But this season he’s not close to that. And he’s had plenty of playing time this season, so it’s not a small sample. Maybe at 36 years old he’s not the hitter he was. It wouldn’t be unusual. (That doesn’t make him “a dog” 😉)
I think we’re just asking for a look. At this point it seems worth it. Ruf has a higher floor for the reasons you’ve said, but Vientos has a higher ceiling. What’s the harm in bringing him up for a few games and seeing if there’s some magic?
Because you are building a team, a roster. The Mets have one 3B glove right now, Escobar's. That's it. They lack speed and have two slow guys at DH. They surely could use another arm. Why duplicate the extremely limited role of DH against LHP and ignore other more pressing needs? Because you are hoping for magic? That's the plan? Again, you have to ignore just about everything about the 2022 NY Mets in order to think that bringing up Vientos at this point is the right move.
I am seeing a player with strong ABs -- I've liked what I've seen -- and an .800+ OPS this very year w/ serious pop.
He's the guy they traded for. He's the guy. You don't get anywhere in baseball by casting aside perfectly good players because of a brief dry spell. We had someone here screaming to DFA Escobar. Where would we be right now without him? Who would play 3B?
Ruf is our guy and he is far more proven -- and likely fits in the clubhouse better -- than 22-year-old Vientos who we'd be asking to adapt to an extremely difficult role.
Yes. Is there a problem with that? 🤪